Need help for opening BBQ stand

[Mr.Nightmare]

Hi guys, as I mentioned about starting a BBQ stand in a topic before, I have some problems that I need your help. Sorry because I have too many questions in my head.

1. I'm looking for a BBQ oven and a medium refrigerator which is suitable for a 4x4m food stand at the market square (tori). What kind of oven do you think I need to use (gas or coal)? Do I need a smoker oven? Where can I get these things with ideal price?
2. I'm still planning what I'm going to sell, but I don't know much about the Finnish people's taste or the way they enjoy BBQ. Which kind do you like in summer: meat stick or sliced meat or meat with bread? I don't have any tables or chairs, so it must be convenient and possible to take-away.
3. Do I really need a credit card machine for buyer's payment? I don't know anything about this kind of machine, I heard that it's quite expensive and I need a telephone line connected.
4. I'm not clear about how they tax me. I think I have to pay tax depending on my revenue or income but if I don't use the credit card machine how can they know how much I have to pay?
5. Do you have any experiences in BBQ stand or some kinds of food stand, especially the average income per month? My expected in come is 2000-3000euro per month and I'm planning to sell everyday of the week, including Wednesday, Friday, Saturday's nights. Is it possible?

Thank you for reading and I appreciate all your helps.

[MagicJ]

I'd recommend doing some market research.

[Rosamunda]

4x4 metres is a huge lot. If you are not providing seating then why would you need such a huge space? Have you already secured a lot and signed a rental agreement? Have you done a business plan? Have you calculated what your turnover will have to be in order to break even?

I would be astonished if there are still available lots for this summer.

I really think you should take one of the business start-up courses provided by the city of Helsinki. And find out what you need in terms of health and safety documentation.

Taxation depends on what kind of company you set up. You will be liable for VAT as well as company tax and/or personal income tax.

You don't need a credit card machine but you have to provide sales receipts to all customers who ask for one (incl VAT) and don't forget that banks charge commission for depositing cash (coins) in your business account. By the way, there are no ATMs on the tori, so you might lose customers if you don't take plastic. It is highly likely that the tax office will soon require all market traders to use electronic cash registers with VAT tracking devices (this is already the case in other nordic countries).

[Mr.Nightmare]

I'd recommend doing some market research.

I did research the market but I'm living in Kokkola-a small town, so there're not any one who did it before. I lack of information. Moreover, unfortunately, all the ones have experiences in this kind of aspect cannot speak English. My Finnish is terrible.

[Mr.Nightmare]

4x4 metres is a huge lot. If you are not providing seating then why would you need such a huge space? Have you already secured a lot and signed a rental agreement? Have you done a business plan? Have you calculated what your turnover will have to be in order to break even?

I would be astonished if there are still available lots for this summer.

I really think you should take one of the business start-up courses provided by the city of Helsinki. And find out what you need in terms of health and safety documentation.

Taxation depends on what kind of company you set up. You will be liable for VAT as well as company tax and/or personal income tax.

You don't need a credit card machine but you have to provide sales receipts to all customers who ask for one (incl VAT) and don't forget that banks charge commission for depositing cash (coins) in your business account. By the way, there are no ATMs on the tori, so you might lose customers if you don't take plastic. It is highly likely that the tax office will soon require all market traders to use electronic cash registers with VAT tracking devices (this is already the case in other nordic countries).

In fact, 4x4 is the minimum size of food stand here in Kokkola, so I have to accept it. I just have small space for table and chair therefore I want to focus mainly on take-away BBQ. My break-even point is about 2000euro. So I think that I will break that point in more than half of the first month.
I will also install a credit card machine, but I just don't know much about this because there's something related to bank and tax office.
The main problem here I don't have car so it's quite difficult for me to go around to buy stuff.Therefore, I need some particular place to get these stuffs. I also don't know how Finnish people eat BBQ whether it's like American.

[cors187]

I also don't know how Finnish people eat BBQ whether it's like American.

Well Finland has a huge selections of processed meats, someone must be eating those.

[Tiwaz]

In fact, 4x4 is the minimum size of food stand here in Kokkola, so I have to accept it. I just have small space for table and chair therefore I want to focus mainly on take-away BBQ. My break-even point is about 2000euro. So I think that I will break that point in more than half of the first month.
I will also install a credit card machine, but I just don't know much about this because there's something related to bank and tax office.
The main problem here I don't have car so it's quite difficult for me to go around to buy stuff.Therefore, I need some particular place to get these stuffs. I also don't know how Finnish people eat BBQ whether it's like American.

Depends on what your BBQ style is. Overall you could check by getting a close look at various products available in stores. Those are at least reasonably close to what Finns are used to eat. Then spice it up a bit compared to store offered stuff.

For credit card machine, contact Luottokunta. They rent devices, so you might be able to get one at reasonable cost from there. They also help you with other matters.

Check also hygiene requirements for providing food. You might have to pass some kind of hygiene course to be viable for selling and preparing food.

Your biggest issue is quite likely language. Your customers are going to prefer their language over yours. Specially with generations who are not as fluent in foreign languages. Who, amusingly, might be biggest group of potential customers since they still have habit of wandering about in marketplaces.

[kiwijim]

First - let us know when it opens.....

Payment terminals are great and do cost a small fortune ( http://www.nets.fi/iWL250G.aspx ) but if you do not invest in that option just make sure you find out where the closest locations to "otto's" (cash machines) are in relation to your stall. It shouldn't be too much of an issue not to have a payment terminal, as your BBQ prices should be too high.

You could be looking at separating yourself from the competition (local grills and burger franchise), you will find at least one stall that sells the makkara (sausage) so best to offer out steak sandwiches, even sausages with bread and onion or even go ethnic!

You will need to hold an Evira hygiene pass, you can do the exam in English here's a link for you http://www.evira.fi/portal/en/food/hygiene_proficiency/

Do yourself a favor and learn enough Finnish to say a simple "Hi" , what your food is and to talk about weather and you will be fine.

[Rosamunda]

The hygiene pass is not enough. You need a trading permit (for food) from the local municipality. They will inspect your plans (eg equipment, waste disposal, refridgeration, staff hygiene etc) and give approval before you start trading.


I found this: http://www.markkina.net/kauppiaanabcopa ... glanti.pdf

It should answer a lot of your questions!

[catfish78]

Are you offering barbecue or just grilled meats? There is a massive difference between the two. From your first question, it makes me wonder whether or not you no what barbecue is.

[Tiwaz]

First - let us know when it opens.....

Payment terminals are great and do cost a small fortune ( http://www.nets.fi/iWL250G.aspx ) but if you do not invest in that option just make sure you find out where the closest locations to "otto's" (cash machines) are in relation to your stall. It shouldn't be too much of an issue not to have a payment terminal, as your BBQ prices should be too high.

Renting one is not that expensive. Luottokunta, while owned by Nets they still operate more or less independently, rents same device bit cheaper, but delivery costs are higher.

Depending on duration you will run the stand renting the terminal is viable option from either Nets or Luottokunta.

[jessesuomi]

Are you offering barbecue or just grilled meats? There is a massive difference between the two. From your first question, it makes me wonder whether or not you no what barbecue is.

I was kind of thinking the same thing really.... and you said you were needing to make 2000-3000 a month? Do you mean like own salary?
What is passed off as BBQ here is sticky, characterless, sugary fake smoke sauce poured over anything cooked. I have only seen one serious attempt at BBQ and that was from that place Ribs in Turku. Oh yeah... another thing, is you are trying to do Amrican types of BBQ (meaning Memphis, Texas, Carolinas ETC.... be prepared to accept the fact the cuts you are trying to cook for those are hardly available here. Try finding proper brisket or sare ribs.... they dont really exist. Yeah, thin, not so meaty ribs... but who wants those if you are really trying to do some Q?

[Karhunkoski]

I had the impression that the OP meant a "Grilli" type kiosk, selling the types of food normally associated with such places.

[catfish78]

I had the impression that the OP meant a "Grilli" type kiosk, selling the types of food normally associated with such places.

In that case he/she needs to call it a Grilli not a BBQ stand.




And no, it is not a semantic argument.