Appeal?

[KTAL]

Hello, I found my way to this forum while searching for information on Finnish Residence Permit. I had 'moved' to Finland last June with my (Finnish) bf with the intention to further develop our relationship. While I was there, we applied for the RP. We waited 1 year for the decision and now I had come back to my home country (to attend the weddings of close friends), the decision came and my application was rejected.

The rejection was based on 3 reasons: I do not have secure means of support, I do not meet the requirements for being granted a residence permit and I did not deliver the requested information. We were planning for me to enroll in full-time Finnish class at an EU-sponsored organisation and we were told that I will be eligible for student support. Is that sufficient information to support the 1st reason for rejection? If I am planning to move to Finland, why would I have a job in another country?... My bf and I are quite traditional in that we would like to wait until marriage to live together and we do not wish to get married for the sake of a residence permit. Was that the reason for them to say that I do not meet the requirements? That we're not living together pre-marital? As for the 3rd reason, we had actually misunderstood the 'sponsor' term used when they asked for the documents. Because my bf is not 'sponsoring' (paying for) my stay in Finland, we did not realise they were asking for my bf's particulars. We are going to send in the appeal with the 'missing' information.

But now I am stuck with a return ticket in 2 weeks' time, an apartment in Finland and me stranded in another continent. Does anyone have any good advice as to what I'm supposed to do now? Any idea how long the appeal will take based on my case? Should I reapply from my home country? Will I definitely be refused entry if I go on that flight as planned? Your advice will be very much appreciated.

My bf and I are hoping to avoid falling back to a LDR and it seems like the FIS is forcing us to compromise on our principles. This is very depressing and confusing, and I feel my respect for them dropping. I had such good impression of Finnish government before all this.

[Adrian42]

The rejection was based on 3 reasons: I do not have secure means of support, I do not meet the requirements for being granted a residence permit and I did not deliver the requested information. We were planning for me to enroll in full-time Finnish class at an EU-sponsored organisation and we were told that I will be eligible for student support. Is that sufficient information to support the 1st reason for rejection? If I am planning to move to Finland, why would I have a job in another country?... My bf and I are quite traditional in that we would like to wait until marriage to live together and we do not wish to get married for the sake of a residence permit. Was that the reason for them to say that I do not meet the requirements?

Yes.

If you and your bf are not married and you do not have a child together and you are not already living together in the same apartment for at least 2 years, then you cannot get a Residence Permit based on family ties.

[CH]

We were planning for me to enroll in full-time Finnish class at an EU-sponsored organisation and we were told that I will be eligible for student support.

Told by whom? And student support from where? If it is some grant that the organisation in question provides, that would provide "sufficient means of support" in the eyes of Migri, then that might be enough (I have no idea, though, so don't take my word for it). If you mean the student support that Finnish students get then you are not eligible for it unless you have rp that is not a student rp.

If you do not want to get married, then the easiest way for you to get a rp would be to enroll yourself as a student here. But... it has to be something that gives you a degree, just taking Finnish classes (that your Finnish class sounded like) will not be enough for a student rp. Or... get a job and get a rp based on that.

Oh, and... you not living together was probably not the reason for the rejection. For rp you need to have lived together for 2 years if you aren't married, as far as I know.

[KTAL]

If you and your bf are not married and you do not have a child together and you are not already living together in the same apartment for at least 2 years, then you cannot get a Residence Permit based on family ties.

We practically live together; we just don't sleep together. But I guess that doesn't apply. Thanks for the info, though.

[KTAL]

Understandably, you are very disappointed, but (and you know this is coming) rules are rules. Personal principles take a back seat to the law.

Getting married and then moving here, coming here on a tourist visa and getting married in that 3 months or getting accepted into a F/T educational program whilst meeting all the requirements financially will make your application for a RP more tolerable for the appropriate civil servants.

Your bf will be able to sort out your flat.

Thanks for chipping in.. I understand what you mean. Though its a little ironic that this is the law of a country well known for its Christian values.

[KTAL]

Told by whom? And student support from where? If it is some grant that the organisation in question provides, that would provide "sufficient means of support" in the eyes of Migri, then that might be enough (I have no idea, though, so don't take my word for it). If you mean the student support that Finnish students get then you are not eligible for it unless you have rp that is not a student rp.

I was told by the person in charge of enrollment in that organisation (have you heard of Palapeli?..). And yes, she did say my residency have to be approved before I can be enrolled. We went there to ask about the Finnish classes and were told that I can only enroll when I have my residency, and that I will be eligible for the student support as it is a full time course. It was a surprise.

But thank you for clarifying that 2 years thing. I do wonder how many people get to live together for 2 years if they can't get residency without it in the first place...

[KTAL]

It's understandable that you're upset but you can't apply for something with wishful thinking. You should have researched all the requirements before applying instead of relying on hear say. Given the information you provided here, an appeal is likely to be rejected too.

I do not really know how to reply that... Your reply is full of insinuations, not advice.

[Adrian42]

If you and your bf are not married and you do not have a child together and you are not already living together in the same apartment for at least 2 years, then you cannot get a Residence Permit based on family ties.

We practically live together; we just don't sleep together. But I guess that doesn't apply. Thanks for the info, though.

It does not matter whether or not you sleep together.

It does matter whether or not you have been living in the same apartment for 2 years.

[Adrian42]

We were planning for me to enroll in full-time Finnish class at an EU-sponsored organisation and we were told that I will be eligible for student support.

Told by whom? And student support from where? If it is some grant that the organisation in question provides, that would provide "sufficient means of support" in the eyes of Migri, then that might be enough (I have no idea, though, so don't take my word for it).

No.

Fulfilling an income requirement is required for some Residence Permits, but it is never enough.
(That is different from EU citizens, where sufficient means of support are enough for registering the Right of Residence.)

For getting a Residence Permit for Finland, one needs a reason.
Usually one of work, university studies or family ties is the reason.

[KTAL]

It does not matter whether or not you sleep together.

It does matter whether or not you have been living in the same apartment for 2 years.

I mean it literally. We practically live together = we spend most of our time in the same place. We don't sleep together = we go to our own beds. Nonetheless, no reason to go into detail - I'm sure the immigration officer won't accept that.

For getting a Residence Permit for Finland, one needs a reason.
Usually one of work, university studies or family ties is the reason.

Yea, I'm getting the drift of that. We're discussing how to overcome this hurdle.

[Adrian42]

For getting a Residence Permit for Finland, one needs a reason.
Usually one of work, university studies or family ties is the reason.

Yea, I'm getting the drift of that. We're discussing how to overcome this hurdle.

Usually the easiest Residence Permit is the one for university studies.

The requirements for a one year Residence Permit for university studies are that you got accepted at a Finnish university, and that you have at least € 6720 in your own bank account.

The problem here is the timing:
Application for university is at the beginning of the year and studies start in September, so it would take one year until you would have that Residence Permit (assuming you got accepted to a Finnish university).

[Adrian42]

Understandably, you are very disappointed, but (and you know this is coming) rules are rules. Personal principles take a back seat to the law.

Getting married and then moving here, coming here on a tourist visa and getting married in that 3 months or getting accepted into a F/T educational program whilst meeting all the requirements financially will make your application for a RP more tolerable for the appropriate civil servants.

Your bf will be able to sort out your flat.

Thanks for chipping in.. I understand what you mean. Though its a little ironic that this is the law of a country well known for its Christian values.

What's ironic about that?

"No sex before marriage" is completely uncommon in Finland and nothing the Evangelical Lutheran Church of Finland demands.
Divorces are also pretty common in Finland and not a problem at all for the Evangelical Lutheran Church of Finland - I even know a female Finnish priest who is herself divorced.

Finland cannot blindly hand out Residence Permit to anyone when someone suddenly says some other person is his/her bf/gf (no matter the gender - homosexual relationships and heterosexual relationships are treated equally, and gay marriage is also treated equally to traditional marriage when applying for a Residence Permit).

You have to be able to prove some relationship, and having a child together or marriage or 2 years of living in the same apartment is a reasonable rule.

[Adrian42]

Usually the easiest Residence Permit is the one for university studies.

The requirements for a one year Residence Permit for university studies are that you got accepted at a Finnish university, and that you have at least € 6720 in your own bank account.

The problem here is the timing:
Application for university is at the beginning of the year and studies start in September, so it would take one year until you would have that Residence Permit (assuming you got accepted to a Finnish university).

The OP needs to understand that if she decides to go for a student residence permit then she will not be eligible for any kind of social assistance and will have to pay for everything including health care costs. She will also not be eligible for any integration courses. She needs to think hard of what she wants to do. Marriage or cohabitation provides a residence permit with all the benefits of integrating and settling in Finland. A study permit is time constrained and costy without any benefits except for earning a degree and giving the OP more time to consider whether or not she wants to tie the knot.

All the "integration courses" and "benefits of integrating and settling in Finland" with a family Residence Permit basically boils down to learning Finnish. And you can do that also while studying.
I'd also doubt that an integration course is necessarily better for integration than university studies with all the social contacts you get at university.
And regarding "except for earning a degree" - a degree is much better in your CV than several years of unemployment while learning Finnish. And if the OP ever decides to leave Finland the degree might still be valuable, while speaking Finnish might not be.

Apart from that you are right, from a financial point of view marriage would be better than coming as a student.

[Pursuivant]

The rejection was based on 3 reasons: I do not have secure means of support, I do not meet the requirements for being granted a residence permit and I did not deliver the requested information. We were planning for me to enroll in full-time Finnish class at an EU-sponsored organisation and we were told that I will be eligible for student support. Is that sufficient information to support the 1st reason for rejection? If I am planning to move to Finland, why would I have a job in another country?... My bf and I are quite traditional in that we would like to wait until marriage to live together and we do not wish to get married for the sake of a residence permit. Was that the reason for them to say that I do not meet the requirements? That we're not living together pre-marital? As for the 3rd reason, we had actually misunderstood the 'sponsor' term used when they asked for the documents. Because my bf is not 'sponsoring' (paying for) my stay in Finland, we did not realise they were asking for my bf's particulars. We are going to send in the appeal with the 'missing' information.

So, what "reason" did you give for applying this residence permit? There are three reasons: work, study, family.
a) Work means you have a job lined out, the employer has filled in the appropriate paperwork, and there is nobody in the EU willing or able to do the job.
b) Study means you have been accepted onto a bachelor's or master's course in an university, have enough funds etc. etc.
c) Family means you are married to a resident or have cohabited with a citizen (abroad) for 2 years.

So, which of these would you be? The rules are quite clear - if you actually want a residence permit, you need to fulfill ALL the requirements fror a "reason" and have "proof" of this - intentions, wishes and wanting is not "proof" I'm afraid.

[Pursuivant]

Apart from that you are right, from a financial point of view marriage would be better than coming as a student.

Basically, a "student" is by default ineligible for any aid or government handouts and must provide their own healthcare. Add to that renewing the RP yearly and having then to apply either a Work or Family RP after the studies...

As "family" you are entitled to everything available for a resident inc. student handout if you decide to go study, and a few things more like the integration allowance and courses.