Health services without kela card

[Adrian42]

It is a shame if there is no way to insure against this and that there is a "blind spot" where honest hard working people cannot be protected due to the length of stay (too long for aninsurance from country of residence, too short to qualify for Kela).

Their country of residence is Finland.
And they do have health care coverage from Kela from the moment they came to Finland (since they work for at least 4 months in Finland).

But the free Kela coverage for all family members requires a 2 year work contract.

[Liam1]

Adrian I understand that. However "protection of honest working people" includes their dependents in my book!

[utpala2011]

What do you mean by "health care coverage from kela"? (excuse me, now I understood what you meant, yes both me and my husband are covered and only our child is not covered)

I actually would be delighted if there is an option to get paid medical treatment at nominal rates, for vaccination and the general health problems. In France the government charge for a visit to the pediatrician with an appointment was 28 euros, which seems quite affordable in case of no-coverage (though we had insurance and also paid extra for complementary insurance). I remember I had to take my daughter 3 times in a single month in France due to persistent ear infection which would cost me ~450 euros in a single month versus ~130 euros. I am not expecting that services be free, but the private health services seem very very expensive.

One of my colleague tells me that in case of emergencies the government health centers would provide the necessary medical assistance. It would be nice if employers offer some kind of health insurance with extra cuts from the salary for family members, that should be possible as there would be a lot of people especially in academic domain from different countries and would be a group insurance kind of a thing at the organizational level.

[interleukin]

Is there any kind of postdoc association at the Uni you're working at? At least for foreign PhD students, HY has insurance (it covers only that student, but maybe it can be expanded to cover the family). Maybe there is a way to buy extra insurance through those kinds of associations.

[Adrian42]

What do you mean by "health care coverage from kela"?

If you or your husband are sick, you can get treatment in the public Finnish healthcare system just like a Finn.

It would be nice if employers offer some kind of health insurance with extra cuts from the salary for family members, that should be possible as there would be a lot of people especially in academic domain from different countries and would be a group insurance kind of a thing at the organizational level.

group insurance kind of a thing won't automatically make it cheap.
The insurance premium would still have to be high enough to offer a reasonable profit to the insurance company after having paid all medical bills (including the bills of family members with expensive diseases).
In other words, the insurance premium for a toddler always has to be significantly higher than the average healthcare costs of a toddler.

And the only reason why your toddler is not covered by the public Finnish healthcare system is that your contract is shorter than 2 years.

If an employer cares about the coverage of the family members of an employee he doesn't have to do anything fancy for providing an insurance - he can simply give the employee a contract for at least 2 years.

[utpala2011]

group insurance has to be significantly cheaper (if not exactly cheap) compared to the premium that has to be set at an individual level, isn't it?

[Adrian42]

group insurance has to be significantly cheaper (if not exactly cheap) compared to the premium that has to be set at an individual level, isn't it?

Why should it?

The main factor for that insurance premium would be the average healthcare costs of a toddler - the insurance premium always has to be higher than that.

Group insurance decreases the administrative costs and customer acquisition costs of the insurance company, but it does not reduce the medical bills of the insured toddlers.

[utpala2011]

Do you have a particular work experience in this domain? In a company a few years back, we (all the employees and their family members including dependent parents) were covered under group insurance. While we were being explained the terms and conditions, we were told that this is based on expected risk over the whole group. the probability of a large number being sick at the same period is rather low, and the people in the 'group' might be of different age groups, so the expected risk has to be lower than for a group consisting of just toddlers(?). Anyway, I might be wrong as I don't have any specific experience in insurance sector.

It would be good if our (or for at least one of us) work contract is extended for a second year.

[Adrian42]

we were told that this is based on expected risk over the whole group. the probability of a large number being sick at the same period is rather low, and the people in the 'group' might be of different age groups, so the expected risk has to be lower than for a group consisting of just toddlers(?).

That's the "other people pay a higher premium so that you have to pay less" model.

But what's the age distribution of family members of people who have a contract for less than 2 years in the academic sector?

That's their spouses (high costs during maternity, otherwise low costs) and their toddlers (high costs).

As soon as the first kid is enrolled in school, people tend to avoid taking their family to a completely different country for just one year.

[utpala2011]

I guess people are not bound to take any kind of insurance at all. It is a matter of choice. Governments don't give a choice of opting in or opting out of social security system, which is again like a group insurance kind of a thing. Some countries just don't have any kind of social security, countries which have them, every working person is a part of it and there is no choice, an unmarried guy/girl or a couple who have decided against having kids or many such cases who I don't think visit doctors often. I remember while I was studying, I had never visited the doctor not once (the same with my husband), that was before I was expecting my baby. Its the same now. In a family of 3, its only my toddler who requires a visit to the doctor, that too after she has started going to the day-care and for the vaccinations. If the public health centers provide the necessary services and charge for them which would go to the government, that would be possible at a much lower cost. After all they wont need to do anything to attract people which should increase the operational costs significantly for private health clinics.

I am not sure about the assumption of age distribution of people in the academic sector who come with a contract of less than a year. There are exchange students who come for one year or less with families sometimes, invited professors (might come with spouses) for 6 months or a year.

[Adrian42]

I guess people are not bound to take any kind of insurance at all.

Everyone who lives permanently in Finland is covered by Kela.

Prerequisite for a non-EU citizen for obtaining a Residence Permit as a student is a valid health insurance.

Family member of a non-EU citizen whose work contract is for less than 2 years is a special case you are running into, and the easiest solution for the Finnish government would be to make in such cases a valid health insurance for the family member a prerequisite for obtaining the Residence Permit.

There are exchange students who come for one year or less with families sometimes,

If the student is an EU citizen coming from another EU country, he and his family usually stay covered by the health insurance of the country they are coming from - which often entitles him and his family to the same access to the Finnish public healthcare system as Finns.

Prerequisite for a non-EU citizen for obtaining a Residence Permit as a student is that he already has health insurance for himself.

If a non-EU citizen wants to come as a student to Finland and bring his wife, he must show that he has at least € 15,120 in his own bank account for obtaining a one year Residence Permit. With two children, he needs € 25,920 in his bank account.

For EU citizens coming to Finland from another EU country there is EU legislation ensuring that they are at any time a member of the social security system of exactly one country.
Non-EU citizens coming as students with their family to Finland are extremely rare.

[AldenG]

Is this the first cluster of recurrent ear infections?

One of the significant discoveries of, oh, maybe the last 20 years, is that longer-term recurrent ear infections among children are often "caused" by sensitivity to milk products. In susceptible children (and even some adults) milk products cause chronic excess mucus in the ear-nose-throat region. Mucus is a friendly environment for ear infections to take hold and it also makes infections harder to eliminate once they are present.

Other foods can do the same thing but milk seems to be the most common food problem when it comes to ear infections.