How the hell do I fund this masters?!

[inkku]

Now, is unpaid internship even possible, why did I have the perception that it would be illegal in Finland?

[betelgeuse]

OP here, thanks for the replies! I am a noob with forums and cannot work out how to quote -_-, it just quotes the whole post each time.

It's just a text field that you type into. You can freely remove stuff between the quote tags.

1. BETELGEUSE... Im pretty sure I can live in Finland any which way? its part of the EU.

This is a common misconception.

http://europa.eu/legislation_summaries/ ... 152_en.htm

"The right of residence for more than three months remains subject to certain conditions. Applicants must:"

This is the sentence that pisses me off, I AM REGISTERING on the basis im there to do an internship... This has been a longer term plan AND I simply applied to the masters because I thought, heck, I may as well be super productive whilst there! SO TO ME THE MASTERS IS NOT MY PRINCIPLE PUROPSE :/... they need to rephrase this sentence.

It does not matter what you think is the primary purpose. It matters what the Finnish officials decide is the purpose based on the law of Finland.

p.s did you used to play MGO by anychance?

Not really.

I am considering getting on a plane and actually going to the KELA office to sort this out.
The thing is their website is horrific and if I was to just go on 'literal' sentences, I would be entitled to benefits for study!

I would rather call their phone numbers (with Skype so you pay less).

Betelgeuse is of course wrong when claiming that registering a Right of Residence based on sufficient means of support would imply Kela coverage.

My post was backed up by links to Kela. What is the basis of your opinion? Here's some further reading for you:

http://www.finlex.fi/fi/laki/kaannokset ... 931573.pdf

Check Chapter 2.

Now, is unpaid internship even possible, why did I have the perception that it would be illegal in Finland?

Usually when people do unpaid internships it's a mandatory part of their studies. I could not Google any sources that would support a general ban. I can easily see it being possible for at least non profits since people since many people regularly volunteer for them.

[GermanInHelsinki]

Betelgeuse should of course read the chapter of the law she was linking to, and the Kela link she gave.

If she would read what is not covered even by Section 3a 4, she would of course understand that her claim was wrong. The Kela link she gave of course also has some examples for this case.

The most common example is of course that the baby of a non-EU university researcher who comes to Finland with a 1 year contract of course gets a Residence Permit as a family member, but if she reads the Kela link she gave she will understand why this baby is of course excluded from Kela healthcare coverage.

[betelgeuse]

The most common example is of course that the baby of a non-EU university researcher who comes to Finland with a 1 year contract of course gets a Residence Permit as a family member, but if she reads the Kela link she gave she will understand why this baby is of course excluded from Kela healthcare coverage.

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/imply

As you can see here suggest can be used as a synonym for imply. With that meaning my statement can't be proven wrong by a counter example because it suffices that most people who register right of residence get Kela coverage. Additionally, your example is irrelevant. We are talking about people with registered right of residence, not people who need residence permits.

[betelgeuse]

Betelgeuse should of course read the chapter of the law she was linking to, and the Kela link she gave.

If she would read what is not covered even by Section 3a 4, she would of course understand that her claim was wrong. The Kela link she gave of course also has some examples for this case.

I reread the law and I still stand besides my writing (which makes your usage of "of course" wrong). The law allows does not require you to satisfy any of the items on the list:

"As circumstances indicating the permanence of residence of the person moving to Finland are taken into account, among others, that the person:"

It should also be noted that the unofficial translations often lag behind in terms of incorporating amendments. The current law has a different list:

http://www.finlex.fi/fi/laki/ajantasa/1 ... 1573#L2P3a

Since the exact contents of the list were not relevant for my post, I did not do a comparison before this.

[GermanInHelsinki]

You claimed that students were the only exception. So one example is of course enough to prove you wrong.

Right of Residence or RP is of course irrelevant - Kela does not care which of the two you have.

You have of course still failed to prove your ridiculous claim that registering a Right of Residence based on sufficient means of support (which is not studies, which you claimed to be the only exception) would automatically entitle to full Kela coverage - including student benefits. You should of course bring proof for that, since that is exactly what applies for the OP.

[fineng3]

Thanks again for the replies

Regardless, im going to talk to KELA, it cant do any harm. I doubt it will do 'good' either but hey.

The Uni I would be doing this masters at isn't registered with some agency THUS making it impossible for me to get a career development loan from the UK. so that door too has shut -_-.

I have of course considered getting a job alongside study, in fact the week I was in Helsinki I handed out CVS, asked around and dedicated at least 2 full days to it... I got CLOSE in a bar, but they needed me to work a full day alone... Due to my Finnish being jussst about average it wasn't possible, they needed fluent -_-. Fair enough of course, but so close!

This is just ridiculous. To get so close, but be so far.
I think I will have a day of chain smoking and sadness, and try again tomorrow.

If anything springs to anyones mind!

[betelgeuse]

You claimed that students were the only exception. So one example is of course enough to prove you wrong.

Students are the only exemption for the implication (subsection 3 of Section 3 a). Since I did not claim that everyone who registers right of residence can get Finnish social security, one example of someone with right of residence and no Finnish social security does not invalidate my point.

Right of Residence or RP is of course irrelevant - Kela does not care which of the two you have.

They do care due to section 3c that sets requirements for the RP:

http://www.finlex.fi/fi/laki/ajantasa/1 ... 1573#L2P3c

You have of course still failed to prove your ridiculous claim that registering a Right of Residence based on sufficient means of support (which is not studies, which you claimed to be the only exception) would automatically entitle to full Kela coverage - including student benefits. You should of course bring proof for that, since that is exactly what applies for the OP.

The OP has a hard time convincing the authorities to not consider the student subsection since he is already accepted to an institution. However, had the OP arrived to Finland and registered right of residence based on sufficient money in the bank account and applied for studies after a positive decision from Kela, then indeed student benefits would be possible.

http://www.kela.fi/web/en/financial-aid ... n-students

"You can get financial aid if the basis for the registration of your right of residence is that you and your family have sufficient funds and, where necessary, can show proof of health insurance coverage (i.e., the purpose of residence in Finland is something other than employment or education)"

I doubt we will start to agree on this topic by discussing it more. This will be my last reply to this thread about it and unless you changed your mind, we will just have to agree to disagree. Readers of the posts can make up their own minds based on the information provided. For those interested in reading more about the topic, here's a link to the Kela handler instructions that they use when processing the applications for being under Finnish social security:

http://www.kela.fi/documents/10180/5782 ... 121217.pdf

[Pursuivant]

I have of course considered getting a job alongside study, in fact the week I was in Helsinki I handed out CVS, asked around and dedicated at least 2 full days to it... I got CLOSE in a bar, but they needed me to work a full day alone... Due to my Finnish being jussst about average it wasn't possible, they needed fluent -_-. Fair enough of course, but so close!

If you read here, people been passing cv's here 3-6-9 months , not 2 days, and not gotten the time of day, so I'd say you're pretty employable.

Try get a job in UK in a pub only speaking Polish

[fineng3]

pursuivant

you don't gain much from the negative posting? And it certainly doesn't aid the goal of this thread, IF I was a friend of yours, would you scratch your head and try find solutions or say the same things?

People have been handing out CV's for up to 9 months with no success? WELL that means...

1. They are on Kela benefits, and able to stay unemployed in Finland for up to 9 months and survive.

2. They are incredibly wealthy and can afford to not work for 9 months.

3. They are living at home or crashing at a friends / relatives.

I can not get Kela, I am not wealthy and I don't have any friends or relatives I can live with for 9 months free of all living expenses.

I personally think its quite admirable that I took a plane to Finland and stayed for a week,With the rationale of leaving with a job! I couldn't afford this trip so close to when im meant to start UNI, but I did it for the same reason ive been learning Finnish for 3 years, went to UNI and surrounded myself with as many friends as possible... solely to be better equipped to move to Finland.

So pleaseee leave the moot points aside?

[rinso]

IF I was a friend of yours, would you scratch your head and try find solutions or say the same things?

A friend will tell you the painful truth, someone else will be polite and sugar coat it.

Maybe you have what it takes to overcome your problems here. But 9 out of 10 will have a miserable time if they come here without a solid foundation or a plan B (or C).
Realizing that Finland is not the land of milk and honey and that foreigners don't get hand outs just because they want to come here, is a good indication what to expect.

[interleukin]

pursuivant

People have been handing out CV's for up to 9 months with no success? WELL that means...

1. They are on Kela benefits, and able to stay unemployed in Finland for up to 9 months and survive.
2. They are incredibly wealthy and can afford to not work for 9 months
3. They are living at home or crashing at a friends / relatives.
So pleaseee leave the moot points aside?

Your view of the world is quite naive. You forget the group of people who don't have KELA, aren't wealthy, and waste their entire savings on something stupid. Like this grand dream of the magic land of Finland.

Finland is great if you have your !"#¤% sorted out, it's not if you haven't. I've been there.

[cors187]

pursuivant

People have been handing out CV's for up to 9 months with no success? WELL that means...

1. They are on Kela benefits, and able to stay unemployed in Finland for up to 9 months and survive.
2. They are incredibly wealthy and can afford to not work for 9 months
3. They are living at home or crashing at a friends / relatives.
So pleaseee leave the moot points aside?

Your view of the world is quite naive. You forget the group of people who don't have KELA, aren't wealthy, and waste their entire savings on something stupid. Like this grand dream of the magic land of Finland.

Finland is great if you have your !"#¤% sorted out, it's not if you haven't. I've been there.

I get 5% discount on KELA, its a real myth, fudgy world figures for sure.

No worker should get sick here, MEDS over indulge in tests which ends up being 3 days salary for a visit.Ive been stung 3 times.

[Rip]

I get 5% discount on KELA, its a real myth, fudgy world figures for sure.

No worker should get sick here, MEDS over indulge in tests which ends up being 3 days salary for a visit.Ive been stung 3 times.

If you go private, that costs. What else is new?

[Flossy1978]

And it's entirely possible those people who don't have work for nine months are living off a decent severance package. If no severance package, lots of people belong to unions who pay for 500 days a certain amount of their previous salary which is mostly more than unemployment. Or living with someone who can help keep them fed and alive. And I believe unemployment money is no longer based on a partner's income if you have one.

You're so naive. Maybe it was sheer luck this time. Maybe not.

Better look up other ways people survive without work before you spout off about them obviously having something wrong with them.