Between two countries

[dreamstep]

Imagine: Someone is a private trader (self-employed person) in Finland, with an A-type residence permit based on own business. The same person has got a permanent job in Sweden, with a similar residence permit there. Because the job in Sweden can be done remotely (at home in Finland), such as web administrator, translator, etc. Taxes are paid according to law.

Question: Is it legal for this person to continue to be a private trader (self-employed person) in Finland, and to keep the A-type residence permit based on own business and live in Finland?

[dreamstep]

I revised my question a bit. The residence permit is not based on family ties. But because family is in Finland, so living together here.

The Finnish residence permit is based on business (self-employment, private trader).

In such a situation, is it legal to work in Sweden with another residence permit (or simply work permit) of Sweden?

[AldenG]

If you could be legally resident in both countries (you can't), you would owe income tax (first bite) to both. So forget the Swedish residence permit. By applying for both, you could end up with neither. And while an RP allows you to reside legally in a country, it does not by itself make you a resident. Majority physical presence is one of several other tests to determine where you reside, which is above all else a tax concept/definition.

[foca]

If you could be legally resident in both countries (you can't), you would owe income tax (first bite) to both. So forget the Swedish residence permit. By applying for both, you could end up with neither. And while an RP allows you to reside legally in a country, it does not by itself make you a resident. Majority physical presence is one of several other tests to determine where you reside, which is above all else a tax concept/definition.

We should distinguish two quite different concepts here: residency and business (along with taxes). In essence residency in one EU country allows you to trade anywhere else, provided that you pay local taxes (if you should, which is not always the case). As a physical being you should have a permanent place of residence where you pay your taxes (that being Finland). If you have income from any foreign sources you will be taxed in Finland (better say- should be taxed in Finland) and may be taxed in the country where the income originates. In compliance with double tax treaties Finland may deduct taxes paid in a foreign country from the amount own by you in Finland. Yet the foreign government may make you register with them , including getting VAT number (depending on the volume and nature if your business), which , in turn , still does not bring a requirement for another residence permit.
Of course cases like that require professional help and careful consideration of all aspects , including applicability of double taxation treaties etc.

[dreamstep]

I asked this question from different ways. But it was still not understood well.

I mean, for example:

Is it possible to have:
(1)residence permit of Finland, based on self-employed;
(2)work permit (not necessarily residence permit) of Sweden, based on a job, not related to the business?

Let's not talk about tax now, only residence permit and work permit.

[betelgeuse]

Is it possible to have:
(1)residence permit of Finland, based on self-employed;
(2)work permit (not necessarily residence permit) of Sweden, based on a job, not related to the business?

The full picture depends on Swedish immigration law and this is not the best forum to find experts on it. In Finland work permits are tied to residence permits and can be cancelled if you are considered to reside elsewhere:

http://www.migri.fi/working_in_finland/ ... the_permit

This will be a problem if Sweden has similar rules. The second potential issue is in Finland when renewing the permit, the sole trader should be active or otherwise you lack the grounds for renewing the permit.

[dreamstep]

Many thanks, tummansininen and all others! Now I have the idea about all that I asked (question seemingly so complicated and special) in several different posts.

[Upphew]

Is it possible to have:
(1)residence permit of Finland, based on self-employed;
(2)work permit (not necessarily residence permit) of Sweden, based on a job, not related to the business?

1. yes
2. yes

So you'll need one of these: http://www.migrationsverket.se/English/ ... ments.html
And remember this: http://www.migri.fi/coming_to_finland_o ... nce_permit

[dreamstep]

Hi, Upphew, your information is really helpful!

[foca]

I asked this question from different ways. But it was still not understood well.

I mean, for example:

Is it possible to have:
(1)residence permit of Finland, based on self-employed;
(2)work permit (not necessarily residence permit) of Sweden, based on a job, not related to the business?

Let's not talk about tax now, only residence permit and work permit.

In most cases (country wise) a work permit equals a resident permit , unless resident permit is issued on non- business (usually family situation) basis. Basically it means that there residence permits that allow one to work (which is in essence a work permit) and those that do not allow the bearer to work ( for example a family member supervising an underage child who goes to school in the country). The second type of permits are residence without employment (we shall not consider different education visas that normally allow for partial employment ).
So to cut it short , there may be a residence permit without employment but there are no work permits without residence, which makes you question irrelevant. What Swedish immigration service means under "work permit" is a residence permit with employment when you actually have a job in Sweden (but may be placed outside the county, let us say - on oil rig).
A work permit without residence rights does not exist - the whole matter becomes, from a legal point, a question of your taxation . Thus a Swedish company may employ a foreigner who works for it abroad and it does not require any permit (perhaps only some restrictions concerning local employment may be applies to the company) - it is purely a tax question, but the moment s/he comes to work in Sweden the requirement for work permit comes into force.

[cors187]

It says in the link http://www.migrationsverket.se/English/ ... weden.html

Travel with a temporary residence permit

If you have a temporary residence permit and leave Sweden, you can return provided the permit is still valid.

If you have left Sweden, you should contact a Swedish embassy or consulate-general to check that your permit is still valid if you have for example:

been granted a permit on the grounds of a relationship and the relationship has ended
studied but have discontinued your studies
been in Sweden as an employee and have left your job or been dismissed
been in Sweden as a self-employed person and no longer run a business.

So if your business is still running there is nothing else to do but cash in on the swedish side.
Applying for the next permit i guess you will need to show reasons why you no longer reside in sweden.


The finnish side of things is similar.

[dreamstep]

Hello Friends,

Finally I asked the Police Department. I am astonished that the I got the answer like this:

1. One can continue the business (self-employment) in Finland and keep the Finnish residence permit, but requirement for minimum residence time is 6 months within one year.
2. At the same time, one can be employed in another country, by having a residence permit of that country, whereever you live there or not.
3. If one gets residence permits from 2 countries, will Finland cancel Finnish residence permit? No.
4. If one has population registration in both countries, will Finland cancel Finnish registration? No.

Whether one can meet requirement for period of residence in 2 countries, is another matter. NOT LEGAL OR ILLEGAL, BUT SIMPLY TECHNICAL.

5. One can apply for two or more kinds of permits (residence based on self-employment, plus permit for work as an employee AT THE SAMETIME) even in FINLAND. When one meets such a situation, just apply for it. A BIG ASTONISHMENT (FOR NON-EU CITIZEN).

Are some of such situations new provisions, or already in book for a long time?

[cors187]

Are some of such situations new provisions, or already in book for a long time?

I guess eligibility for double res-permits is limited to workaholics but i guess its been in practice for years now.

12. May I work as a self-employed person on a residence permit for an employed person after my employment relationship ends? Or vice versa, may I work in an employment relationship if I have a residence permit for a self-employed person?

If you have been granted a residence permit for an employed person and your employment relationship ends while that permit is still valid, you may become a self-employed person if you then apply for an extension of your permit on the basis of self-employment.
If you have been granted a self-employed person’s residence permit and you discontinue your business, you may enter an employment relationship if:
- you then apply for a new residence permit on the basis of employment
- your residence permit for a self-employed person is continuous
- you have been an entrepreneur, and not a practitioner

[dreamstep]

- your residence permit for a self-employed person is continuous

What is the meaning of "continuous"? A-type residence permit (1-year or 4-year?), or P-type residence permit? Is 1-year A-type a continuous one?