Car or No Car?

[lpage160]

Looking online I'm seeing different opinions on this topic and was wondering if I could get some input from a current Finland resident.

How easy is it to get around without owning a car? I know that some EU countries the public transit is so well spread that you can go from one end to the other and to almost any town without a car. Maybe a short cab ride. Is that the case in Finland as well or is a car more of a necessity rather than optional?

[007]

Looking online I'm seeing different opinions on this topic and was wondering if I could get some input from a current Finland resident.

How easy is it to get around without owning a car? I know that some EU countries the public transit is so well spread that you can go from one end to the other and to almost any town without a car. Maybe a short cab ride. Is that the case in Finland as well or is a car more of a necessity rather than optional?

depends largely on where you live. In Helsinki area, you may not need a car for your daily life, whereas if you live elsewhere and don't limit your daily life in the center, then you will need a car for convenience. Finland is sparsely populated area, and if you intend to use a taxi service frequently, it will burn you bad.

[lpage160]

As of right now I'm looking at a university in Tampere. Helsinki is all well and good but I hear that it's super expensive as far as rent and cost of living goes. Plus I live in a large city right now and... meh, I don't think I'm a city girl... granted where I live is one of the highest crime rates in the U.S. so I'm sure I won't hear near as many sirens and such over there, solely judging from what I've been reading on different forums and posts. Right now I literally hear 6 sirens a day.

Anywho, I did find this website:http://www.journey.fi/en/ Somehow I overlooked it when I did my initial search.

[Rip]

Anywho, I did find this website:http://www.journey.fi/en/ Somehow I overlooked it when I did my initial search.

Interestingly, I did not know about that. I would have guided you to the similar service for just Tampere. I'd think you should be able to manage without a car, worth checking potential apartment locations with that.

Helsinki is all well and good but I hear that it's super expensive as far as rent and cost of living goes.

Housing is more expensive in Helsinki. Otherwise I think the differences are small.

Plus I live in a large city right now and... meh, I don't think I'm a city girl... granted where I live is one of the highest crime rates in the U.S. so I'm sure I won't hear near as many sirens and such over there, solely judging from what I've been reading on different forums and posts. Right now I literally hear 6 sirens a day.

Well, just don't get your apartment on a main access route to a local fire station or hospital...

[riku2]

Right now I literally hear 6 sirens a day.

I did have to smile at this. So you think six sirens a day is some indication of the high crime level? I just got back from a week in Paris, where at one point I heard them non stop for about an hour, plus half the cars I saw with blue flashing lights were unmarked cars. And then there were the soldiers on foot patrol in groups of three with machine guns that I saw several times a day. So six a day seems quite a gentle pace of life.

But Finland is not France and crime levels and terrorist threats are substantially lower. Closest thing i've seen to Tampere is Regina in Saskatchewan. It's a big town but not even the crime or traffic of Calgary let alone Toronto.

On the original topic - if you live in any city (although finland really has big towns, not a "city" as someone from US or UK would think of it) then you can survive without a car for sure.

[Rosamunda]

One of my kids lives in Tampere and he has a car but mostly for weekends and hobbies etc. He could easily get around inside Tampere without one.

Btw rents in Tampere aren't cheap and the queues are frightening... So many students all flat hunting at the same time.

Owning a car could make finding a job easier though. My son works part-time as a cook and also as a security guard so he moves around a lot and also at odd hours. I think there is a certain amount of bureaucracy and cost involved if you want to drive here without an EU licence.

[lpage160]

I did have to smile at this. So you think six sirens a day is some indication of the high crime level?

Actually where I live now there are about 20-40 homicides a month involving either someone shooting someone, someone hitting someone with their car, someone stabbing someone, someone committing arson, ... etc. That's how I know the crime rate is high where I currently live. I don't think a siren indicates a high crime rate... I know my city has a high crime rate because I read the news and I've heard the gunshots and I've seen the police cars and the "Do Not Cross" tape. I live in Saint Louis by the way, if you ever heard about the riots in Ferguson Missouri... that's about 5-10 minutes away depending on which highway you use. I generally don't leave my loft after 10pm, unless I'm going to a pub right downstairs.

Needless to say I could use a little peace.

Also, I agree, living on ambulance and fire truck routes is a headache... I lived a right in between a fire station and an airfield in Hawaii... no sleep... ever..

Really happy to know I won't need a car though! Also glad I could find that website, I hope it helps anyone who might need it.

Tummansininen: How did you like Australia?! It's so gorgeous in the photo's I've seen! Though in truth I'm too much of a pansy to visit myself... So many creepy crawlies and animals that .... are not cute and cuddly LOL!

[lpage160]

One of my kids lives in Tampere and he has a car but mostly for weekends and hobbies etc. He could easily get around inside Tampere without one.

Btw rents in Tampere aren't cheap and the queues are frightening... So many students all flat hunting at the same time.

Owning a car could make finding a job easier though. My son works part-time as a cook and also as a security guard so he moves around a lot and also at odd hours. I think there is a certain amount of bureaucracy and cost involved if you want to drive here without an EU licence.

The not having a license thing is what I'm worried about when it comes to getting a car. Also the whole driving on the other side of the road thing.
I keep reading about the long queues are! That's crazy... Do you think it would be better living outside of the city on or near a bus or train route? That's honestly what I was thinking about doing if it would make things easier.

[lpage160]

The cost is the reason I decided not to get a car... and the wrong side of the road thing is why I didn't even bother to get a license here. I STILL sometimes look the wrong way when stepping out onto the road so I'm extra cautious and look all over the place in paranoia - two Canadian pedestrians were killed near my place in Oz because they stepped off the curb looking the wrong way. Certain things are ingrained, and when driving, it's not just the side of the road, it's my head automatically swinging to the right to look for traffic as I approach an intersection (just one example). You would not be driving on the "wrong" side here so you can stop worrying about that part at least.

As for housing, the expected rental differences between cities are not as dramatic as one would expect, because of the high maintenance costs involved - this means that you don't halve your rental price by moving five suburbs away from a city centre. Helsinki in particular is extraordinarily even in price, bizarrely so from an outsider's perspective, you will pay almost the same for a room in an apartment 3 stops from the city as one an hour out of the city. You might then get a room for 350 a month instead of 400, but by the time you pay the extra in bus fares, there is no saving. And Tampere is only going to be maybe 50 euros different.

That! Right there! With the pedestrian thing, that's some of the things I'm so glad that people on here point out! So I can tell you right now there will be no distracting headphones in while walking anywhere when I get there.

As for the rental thing, I am concerned over prices but also about my ability to get an apartment in the first place. I see your point with rental prices being pretty much even once you factor in bus fairs and such, very valid point. However, if it's easier for me to find a place outside the city than waste money on a hotel waiting for a place in the city to maybe come available, I would rather live outside the city and be able to "settle in" a little quicker. Also hotels are expensive and I don't want to drain all of my savings so quickly if I can help it.

[riku2]

something like half of workers use public transport to get to work (even those who have cars often leave them at home during the week).

That seems to tally with my office (Ruoholahti) where about half are using public transport. Some are even coming in from places like Kerava and Hyvinkaa by public transport (about 60km away). In my old office in UK (Hemel Hempstead) about 98% came by car.

lpage160: I'm not sure if you know how expensive cars are to buy in finland. In the UK I routinely see cars parked outside houses with signs for sale and they are under 2000 pounds (about 3000 euro). They are in reasonable condition as well. That money will get you nothing in Finland. I think you can triple that for something that isn't half car/half rust.

[Flossy1978]

Finland, like most countries drive on the same side of the road as America. You'll probably also find Finns drive better than Americans,because they pay a lot of money to take proper schooling to get their license.

I have driven in both Australia and Finland. I've had one small crash in a parking lot which caused no damage. It's not so bad. You just drive extra carefully in the beginning and it doesn't take long to get the hang of it. You soon forget the way you were previously driving and pick up the new habits easily. The same with being a pedestrian. My child did it easily between countries too.

If you live without a car in Tampere you need to be in the centre, or close to it. It's not the biggest city.

You can easily get to Helsinki on the train from Tampere, and other cities, since it is a place where there are alot of train transfers.

The others are right. There's little difference in rental prices. Food, etc, is all the same. Even more expensive the more away from civilisation you get.

As for the deadly creatures in Australia. Suburbia has wiped out most of what can harm you in everyday normal life. If you are dumb enough not to learn how to be safe in the more desolate areas and in the ocean, then more fool you. It would seem since 22 million people live in Australia and very few die each year from the creatures (bar shark attacks), then it's not as bad as foreigners make it out to be. Most people who die from crocs are usually dumbarse tourists. Though the last two to die were dumbarse Aussies who knew better but were stupid this one time. You check your bed before you get in it at night. Shake your shoes out before you put them on. And don't stick your hands into dark hidden places, then you'll be fine.

Personally I think Africa is a whole lot more deadly.

The most poisonous snake in the world is the Inland Taipan of Australia. Do you know how many people have died since it was discovered in 1975? None. How many people have died because of the less toxic Black Mamba in Africa, or cobras in Asia? A crapload.

[Jukka Aho]

Looking online I'm seeing different opinions on this topic and was wondering if I could get some input from a current Finland resident.

How easy is it to get around without owning a car? I know that some EU countries the public transit is so well spread that you can go from one end to the other and to almost any town without a car. Maybe a short cab ride. Is that the case in Finland as well or is a car more of a necessity rather than optional?

As a somewhat recent resident of the capital area (Helsinki, Espoo, Vantaa), my personal experience is you can manage well without a car in any these three conjoined cities if living within the reach of the routes and services of the Helsinki Region Transport. Check out their journey planner. Cannot speak for Tampere, except that they do have a similar service here.

I do not use the websites for journey planning very often, though, except when sitting in front of a PC. Instead, there are several 3rd party mobile journey planning apps you can download on your phone. They use the same public timetable and route data but are aware of your current location on the map and can suggest routes based on that - even alert you by playing a sound or vibrating when you're almost at your destination stop. The dedicated journey planning apps are typically much more convenient to use on a phone (and on the move) than the official websites offered by the regional transport authorities. I have often relied solely on the suggestions of these apps when navigating about the city.

(You got an iPhone? Try downloading an app called Moovit and set your location to whichever larger Finnish city you're interested in - provided the app supports that city. You can try it out even from outside of Finland, but the app will of course display your current location as the default starting point and you will need to override that by explicitly specifying a Finnish street address, instead.)

[lpage160]

If you successfully get a university place and get onto the student housing list fast enough it's possible you'd get offered a room in time for the start of semester.

Many cities also have family units for people who have a spouse or children with them, but I don't know how high the demand is. Most students wait for a single room in shared housing, and it is them who make up the vast majority of people scrambling for accommodation in August. Based on what we see in these forums half of them either never thought about where they will live or expect that they just show up and get handed an apartment the same day. Forewarned is forearmed.

Would I speak to the school about the family housing?

I whole heartedly agree about the forewarned thing! That's what I'm trying to do now. Depending on when I get accepted and get my visa in order I would like to head over there early enough to beat the August Rush.... If I can. I don't know what the student visa would say about when I can go. Here in the U.S. You can get in the queues before you even move somewhere so that there is less wait when you do get there. Can you do the same there?

[Querfeldein]

Car or no car? Both.

I've never bothered with my own car, but I've done car sharing instead, and I intend to join City Car Club in Helsinki. For example, with the "S" package, you pay €10 per month, and €10 per hour of use. Of course, that's not going to cut it if you need a car to commute every day, but if you occasionally want to do some really bulky shopping, or drive to a dark spot with your telescope, where no public transport can get you, it's ideal (coincidentally, a night time booking from 9pm to 8am is only billed as two hours). No worries about registration, insurance, inspections, repairs, cleaning, garages, etc. Urban car ownership is passe.

[lpage160]

Car or no car? Both.

I've never bothered with my own car, but I've done car sharing instead, and I intend to join City Car Club in Helsinki. For example, with the "S" package, you pay €10 per month, and €10 per hour of use. Of course, that's not going to cut it if you need a car to commute every day, but if you occasionally want to do some really bulky shopping, or drive to a dark spot with your telescope, where no public transport can get you, it's ideal (coincidentally, a night time booking from 9pm to 8am is only billed as two hours). No worries about registration, insurance, inspections, repairs, cleaning, garages, etc. Urban car ownership is passe.

Holy crap! Well I would certainly support that! Environmentally friendlier and you don't have to worry about upkeep. I am proud to say that I can change a tire! However not proud that I don't know anything else about cars.. LOL. However that would raise a question about insurance and such, but I don't know how that works over there now