Unpaid sunday hours

[moske[FIN]]

Hello,

I've been working 2 years at a cow farm may2013-may2015, and i saw few days ago that i was paid for sunday hrs the normal hour wage, not double like it should. I requested to my former owner to pay me corectly but i dont get any reply, and, since the sum is big (because i worked there every fkn sunday for 2 years) and this "gentelman" is sooo greedy, i dont think he will pay me a penny at this moment. What should i do? (i contributed every year at YTK, if its important). Thanks in advance

[Upphew]

Hello,

I've been working 2 years at a cow farm may2013-may2015, and i saw few days ago that i was paid for sunday hrs the normal hour wage, not double like it should. I requested to my former owner to pay me corectly but i dont get any reply, and, since the sum is big (because i worked there every fkn sunday for 2 years) and this "gentelman" is sooo greedy, i dont think he will pay me a penny at this moment. What should i do? (i contributed every year at YTK, if its important). Thanks in advance

http://www.tyosuojelu.fi/fi/palkkasaatava
You most likely don't belong to a union, so lawyer up and sue.

[moske[FIN]]

thanks for info.

looks like things start to move forward. i was asked by his accountant to take a look tommorow at the papers i provided for my claim, because my former owner said that i put there more hours than i worked. I explained that i had to do my claim and provide an estimate nr of hours based on my salary rosters that I kept, and, of course, the best way to correct things is that my former owner to provide copies of all my work schedule where is writen loud and clear how many hours i worked every fkn day, especially that the law sais he has to keep those papers carefully, otherwise being a crime.

Also, regarding my claim to be paid for the 30days of vacation earned last year of work, i was told that i ask to much. My calculation is based on what i found on internet about this matter, and if they have a good base or newerbase for calculating those compensations i must be 100% convinced that it is corect. Now since i started to write, can someone give a link that sais the right way to calculate the earned vacation days compensation, please.

I will post tommorow what happent, if important news.
And never forget: when you see a worm or a bug crush it!!! (just the ugly ones and make sure its politically correct, and not racist, and ... the other EU bla bla)

[moske[FIN]]

I just received a visit from my former owner, and he said that he burned all my work schedule papers, but he wrote somewhere what was there, and that acording to whats there he will pay pretty much less. i guess it will end in court. I need to know what places i should go to complain, poliisi, maistrati, ocupational&health office...??? Also, they say that i dont get full payment fro my 14days vacation because i didnt got back to work after vacation (my vacation was takin exactly on the last days of my contract, so, after vacation ended i had no contract anymore); i find this absolutely stupid, is this correct?

[Flossy1978]

What a horrible employer you had. I bet you got the crappiest wage too. I bet the poor animals aren't treated the best either. I hate employers who abuse their employees. Without them the employers wouldn't have a company.

Good luck! I hope you kick his arse!!!

[Querfeldein]

I just received a visit from my former owner

Freudian slip? I wish you good luck, and don't sign anything until you have spoken to a lawyer.
If you don't have legal expenses insurance, you should be able to apply for legal aid. http://www.oikeus.fi/en/index/esitteet/oikeusapu.html

[Evaphio]

I hope you can get back what he owes you.. though normally it takes time.

Some friends of mine were in trouble with farmers, they contacted the local

www.tyosuojelu.fi

They went to the social worker and talked to her, also filled in some papers with their claims. This lady also explained them some things about the legislation.

Also, did you really work every day too? Did you have days off? You need to check this, because I think there is some legislation about it too... I think the employer needs to give you enough time for rest and you can not work every day without any days off.
Also, you need to check if your salary was not lower than it is allowed by the law. You should check these standards. I think the lowest per hour is 8.70 - 10 EUR depending on what kind of job you do.
Think of the working conditions too. If you had all the necessary stuff like health insurance and so on... protective clothes etc. Were you instructed on how to work safely etc... you need to find out what the employer is obliged to provide you with. Did he do it?
I guess they can explain it to you in tyosuojelu.fi ... at least my friends were very lucky to meet a very kind and helpful woman there

As far as I remember my friends also wrote a report to the police.
I do not think your "owner" can burn your papers, I dont know exactly how it works, but usually such employers also hide from tax authorities .... partially. I think you do need to report him to the police and tell them that he wrote less than you really worked and that he destroyed your documents. The farmer that my friends had problems with had to pay a huge fee because he was hiding his real income from the tax authorities
__

You can also open mol.fi and try to find something there.... they can direct you and explain whom you have to contact.

[moske[FIN]]

What a horrible employer you had. I bet you got the crappiest wage too. I bet the poor animals aren't treated the best either. I hate employers who abuse their employees. Without them the employers wouldn't have a company.

Good luck! I hope you kick his arse!!!

"horrible"... you are to kind(i found out that lately) My "Almost" history at farm: deathX2, broken legX4, both hands brokenX1, +other minor things that actually happent but could have been avoided if the farm is well takin care off (but somebody is trying to save a panny every ocasion that he has)

"crapiest wage"... you are to kind: i had 8cents below that(i found out that lately)

"poor animals"... no, plenty of them go to heaven, and I was so happy my last months there for them escaping somehow this way, although it breaks your heart(if you have one) when you see little babies who fight to recover but have no chance because an IDIOT gets to decide their fate nomather how hard i was trying to help them despite the hudge complain from all those freak familly: "you give them to much of that special milk, and that is very expensive", but my last year there i didnt give a !"#¤% about them being greedy and i decided that even if i get fired, no little baby will die on my shift and actually they didnt die also on the evening shift(i was working only morning): they were dying strangelly between friday noon and sunday morning, exactly my time off(saturday free)

"employers who abuse their employees"... after i was raised salary from 8,1/h to 8,5/h(wow:))) i was paid 8months stil 8,1. I told about this after 4months and nothing happent. I told this after 8months again and finally i got the difference in my bank account with MFO(my former owner) telling me happilly that since i have so much money comming from january, then i will pay more taxes ammount, and I told: a tax is a tax, has to be paid, nothing i can do about so i dont stress about this subject. So, you think i didnt stress about this subject anymore? Well, lets see: i gave him in february a paper from tax office for him to give it to his accountant, that paper having my exact tax rates and numbers and all the stuff. What he did, he took that paper from A to B? Noooo, and its not the 3km from the middle of nowhere to Voyri where the accountman office is; he somehow lost the paper, but he assured me that he called tax office to email him that paper, also, since he was on the phone he changed my anual estimation of income to a smaller one, to make sure that those 400e that i got for the 8months of being underpaid will be taxed with a big tax-rate.

"employers who abuse their employees"... i was given a car to use, the car was presented as very well takin care off, and the deal was that i fix whatever i brake. First week service costed 450e, but i said maybe its just one bad luck and i must go on thinking positive. After 1,5 years i spent around 1.500e to fix his junk and i decided to buy cheap car for me after the car broke while driving it and only by luck i didnt had a horrible accident. All this time a paid also the insurance, being supid enough Not to refuse all the !"#¤% i get from MFO just to make sure i keep my precious job:))))) You think this is the end? Nooooo:) After i got my car he tried all the time to force me to let him have "a test drive", his only reason being of course to tell me after: "this is not good, this is not good, this is not good" and sleep happy for the first time since HE took his car from me(without even telling me, i found out my stuf trown out...and so on)

"employees. Without them the employers wouldn't have a company"... new farm, 7years old, maintenance ZERO, owner only checking bank account entrance... even the employees have no power, the stress is huge. Maybe it is a lack of modesty, but i dont know how many people would have resisted there going trough all this !"#¤% that i've been, and, even so, I OFFERED him a contract to sign and he refused me: "10,10e/h its to much. i cant accept this...bla bla bla". Now i'm happy he refused and i realize i was an idiot to offer myself for another year.

"I hope you kick his arse"... This is not about money anymore(although the sum is big after 2 years of incorrect pay)
I will also ask for the report of the last OSH inspection at the farm if it happent in the last 2 years,if not i will request for an inspection so I can have the inspection report so i can present that also on my job interviews for the potential employer to se whoo is providing refferences, since MFO sais at"Arvostelu" about me: "he was a mediocre worker".............

PS sorry for the lenght of the text, but i need to release myself somehow. Also is boring tyoton...

[moske[FIN]]

Also, did you really work every day too?
Also, you need to check if your salary was not lower than it is allowed by the law. You should check these standards. I think the lowest per hour is 8.70 - 10 EUR depending on what kind of job you do.
Think of the working conditions too. If you had all the necessary stuff like health insurance and so on... protective clothes etc. Were you instructed on how to work safely etc... you need to find out what the employer is obliged to provide you with. Did he do it?
As far as I remember my friends also wrote a report to the police.
I do not think your "owner" can burn your papers, I dont know exactly how it works, but usually such employers also hide from tax authorities .... partially.

"Also, did you really work every day too?":
---saturdays off, mostly morning work 4-6-7hrs

"Also, you need to check if your salary was not lower than it is allowed by the law. You should check these standards. I think the lowest per hour is 8.70 - 10 EUR depending on what kind of job you do.":
---Last year salary was 8,5/h but i foound out theese days that the minimum should have been 8,58

"Think of the working conditions too. If you had all the necessary stuff like health insurance and so on... protective clothes etc. Were you instructed on how to work safely etc... you need to find out what the employer is obliged to provide you with. Did he do it? ":
---he made an insurance but i dont know if that was only to cover his ass, protective clothes were provided, work safely instruction are for pussies(its a cow farm after all) and etc etc etc. But do you think all those would've helped me if i would have landed from 8m high because the ladder(tikkat) had the base damaged/unsecure? You think all that !"#¤% would've helped me if the steel wire, who was on maximum tension while we were fixing it without having proper tools, would have broken and beheaded all the people arround?

"I do not think your "owner" can burn your papers":
---he doesnt have them anymore, or he is trying not to show them. I was wondering if hes slow reaction in this mater isnt a way to stel time for some reason. Looks like the reason was that he wrote himself theese days "copies made by him at that time" of all my working schedule papers. Why i think at this: first he sais to the accountman that the estimation of sunday hours that i provided is much more than the real number, but he doesnt prove it with my original working schedule that he must keep according to the law and just gives a number that "he thinks is more close to reality". After that the accountman invites us for a meeting where i must bring what papers i have, and he must bring the original working schedule papers BUT... he fails to get to the meeting and there was no sign of him that day. Next days he says that he burned the original working schedule but he will pay me according to the "coppies that he made after the original working schedule" ))))))
Therefore either he doesnt have them , either he is hiding and presenting false informations because the man likes to..."save a penny" anyhow anyway.

"As far as I remember my friends also wrote a report to the police."
---really? what will be the reason to report to police. As far as i'm concerned, i would like to report him everywhere so please teach me, because, as I said in my previous post, its not about money anymore.

OK mister Jakas Martin, LET THE GAMES BEGIN!!!

[Rosamunda]

I'm not sure about farming but companies have to report their social contributions (TEL) to Vero when they send in their VAT returns every month. I assume farmers have to do something similar, so even if he has burned the paperwork (he has no right to do that), there should be a paper trail at the tax office. You are entitled to receive a salary slip from your employer which shows all your salary information, ask for one in writing.

Generally speaking, Vero and Kela have very little sympathy for employers like him and he could well end up in jail. He's a crook.

Good luck. Don't give up.

PS: If he is providing milk to Valio, maybe you could try contacting them too. I'm sure they have a Corporate Social Responsibility programme:
http://www.valio.com/responsibility/

[Evaphio]

Hello again)

Speaking of why you need to report stuff to the police - because he burnt your documents and he gives you less money than you really worked. I think this is enough a ground. He deprived you of the documents and he is hiding real information from the Finnish authorities as well in this case.

Read here, everything, especially the end....

"Working time records must be kept truthfully. If an employer neglects to keep working time records or keeps records in a wrong way or changes or destroys them, hides them or makes them impossible to read, the employer or his or her representative may be punished as prescribed by the law.

If working time records have been neglected, the court usually trusts the information and notes which the employee presents for example as grounds for a wage claim."
http://www.tyosuojelu.fi/fi/workingtime


Also thell them the story with your taxes.
I also would report to vero.fi the story with your tax card...


All the cases of how he treated you you need report. Some stuff does not seem so ok to me at your place... Like the fact that you had to repair his car at your own expense, and also if you had any injury you have to report about it too. If you had your leg/arm injured at work, the farmer has to compensate and also pay to you for the days you can not be at work ... as far as I know. Everything that you think that does not meet safety requirements should be reported.

But I do not know your situation exacly, I would sit down and write a story with items how everything was. everything about contract, working conditions, records of your working hours, the fact that you repair his car and maybe you remember smth else.... And tell these items to the right person.
My friends they told eveyrthing to tyosuojelu.fi and the farm was actually checked

I wish you good luck....

(also...... it is really wise to always remain polite and politically correct as you said. it helps I think in solving legal issues... )

[moske[FIN]]

Thanks for support,

I was surprized to receive ALL the money I asked for, 7.5k. I was wxpecting to get to the court, but looks like they realized that if they dont pay, this mather will get to the authorities and they will end up paying those money PLUS fines from every office. I told you they have sharp mind. Also i found out yesterday that he checked the people who knew that I worked there sundays, to see if they will sustain him because he wanted to say that I didnt worked there any sunday:)

Now i got in faze two: fixing that "mediocre worker" which i received in Arvostelu, and also them "being concerned that I'm a drunk and being affraid that i am aggressive ". Because, in case i find a job and the porential employer will ask for references from them, thats exactly what they will tell, all of those having no base but having only one purpose: me not getting any job. I must find a way of them explaining those in front of some authorities, or to get some paper which tells to a potential employer that, due to the bad treatment and other stuff, references from my former employer will be not accurate therefore must not be asked. Also his father reminded me that if i find a job THEY will give references...

Also they have a file at poliisi for harrasing my ex-gf, which went from calls and msges everyday, to a visit at her place 30km away, fortunantly the neighbour's dogs were free and he run away and called her after 2min from the safety of his car.

Yesterday, after at 06:00 i sent them reguest for References with acurate information and request for my working time records, they called at 23:00 my ex-gf and told her that i'm a bad person and they will call poliisi for harasment:)))) They though that after I received the money that they owned me, i will keep my mouth shut, and i will regret for what "i did to them" the moment they will be asked for references. Looks like they got used to do whatever they want in the middle of the forest and not taking responsibilities for their actions, but when it comes to civilized world..... "Huston we have a problem"

Thanks again for support! miro

[Rip]

Työtodistuksesta on säädetty työsopimuslain (55/2001) 6. luvun 7 §:ssä. Sen mukaan:

työntekijällä on työsuhteen päättyessä aina oikeus pyynnöstään saada työtodistus
työtodistuksessa on mainittava vähintään työsuhteen kestoaika ja työtehtävät
työntekijän erillisestä pyynnöstä työtodistuksessa on lisäksi mainittava työsuhteen päättymisen syy sekä arvio työntekijän työtaidosta ja käytöksestä tai vain toinen näistä
työtodistuksesta ei saa ilmetä muuta kuin mitä sen sanamuodosta käy ilmi. "Koodeja", lisä- ja piilohuomautuksia tai muita merkintöjä ei saa tehdä

Or in English:

Section 7. Certificate of employment
On termination of the employment relationship, the employee is entitled to receive, on request, a written certificate of the duration of the employment relationship and the nature of the work duties. At the specific request of the employee, the certificate shall include the reason for the termination of the employment relationship and an assessment of the employee's working skills and behaviour. The certificate shall not provide any information other than that obtainable from normal perusal.

So you can always ask for short työtodistus without any "evaluation". Now, this may look bit suspicious in itself, so maybe you should (for your sake) something suitably officially on writing about your employer if the need arises. Again, if you give a future prospective employer the idea that your prone to contact lawyers, they may decide it is best to stay away form you, even if they were not actually the Employer from Hell II. Basically you should look good even on the eyes of those are predisposed to be on the employers side.