immigrants, gay &Kela

[fla08]

Well, I have a long story to tell...it's not so funny...
I moved to finland in dec. 2006, I was seeking for job until february, when I got a contract 4 a part-time job in HKI, Than I went to the police where I registered and that to Maistratti for a provisorial social security numb., after 2 month I got another part-time job, and after proving to police that i had been earning 900€ per month I got finally the permanent residence permit in June 2007 ( ON THE BASIS OF WORK). Unfortunately I didn't register to Kela ( I didn't know), and in August 2007 I started to study. My opintotuki request was denied with kela claiming that my reason for coming to Finland is stdying [but come on who come i december for studying almost 1year after?!], I applied for the complaint and it was denied as well, and so the case is still to be elaborated by the court or I don't know what.

Meantime I'm getting money in the form of Toimentulotuki, which means that I get more money than with Kela, but if I woud work I wouldn't get the part that I'm earning. (Than why woking and paying taxes...?!). My unluck s not over, as my rights have not been respected (even according to Kela's law I'm entitled to get the benefit, and the Kela kortti if only I would have requested it before becoming a student] ) I'm moving with my girlfriend ( who doesn't have finnish citizenship, but something more than the permanent residence, as she has been living here 16 years), this means that I'll have to declare that I'm living with my partner to social office, so getting less money ( or maybe nothing at all), while apparently Kela (as we're 2 women) won't recognise us as a couple, and my request of opntotuki will be denied again, while hetero-couple who live toghether are rocognised and get all the benefits.

Is there anything that I can do about it?

[ajdias]

Last time I checked (a few years ago) you had to be in the country for 2 years prior to the start of your studies to be eligible for opintotuki. Check if that has changed but I doubt. Also, IIRC only nationals of certain countries could apply.

[fla08]

It used to be like that but they change the legislation:
'Non-citizens of Finland can get financial aid for studies in Finland if they live in Finland on a permanent basis for a purpose other than studying. This requires that they are registered as a permanent resident in the Finnish population register system. The purpose of residence in Finland is determined by reference to such matters as the residence permit, registration or acceptance to an educational institution'

'Opintotuki voidaan myöntää, jos oleskeluoikeus Suomessa on rekisteröity ja maassa oleskelun peruste on muu kuin opiskelu. Opintotuki voidaan myöntää,

* jos rekisteröinnin peruste on henkilön työskentely tai ammatinharjoittaminen Suomessa ja hänellä on joko työnantajalta saatu todistus palvelussuhteesta, todistus työssäolosta tai selvitys ammatinharjoittamisesta
* jos rekisteröinti perustuu siihen, että henkilöllä on itseään ja perhettään varten riittävät varat ja tarvittaessa selvitys sairausvakuutuksesta (eli asumisperuste on muu kuin opiskelu tai työskentely) tai
* jos henkilöllä on oleskelulupa ja oleskelu Suomessa perustuu muuhun kuin opiskeluun.'

And I'm from EU, registered as a worker.
but thanks 4 the answer

[blaugrau]

As far as I know, the opintotuki isn't affected by you living in relationship or not, hetero or not. I don't know if you need to tell anyone about your relationship status, I'm not sure what real benefits you would have from it if you're already permanently domiciled in Finland and are from the EU.. I don't know what the rules are with the money you're receiving now, but if this is means-tested and they count in your relationship, then this will only have negative effects. The opintotuki is not means-tested as far as I know, so it wouldn't be affected by it.

[fla08]

That's also true, but I would be entitled to get the kela kortti and then the opintotuki

[blaugrau]

I'm not quite sure about one thing, are you permanently domiciled here? You talk about a permanent residence permit, but this term doesn't apply to your case at all because you are an EU citizen, and as such you don't need a permit in the first place. The question is, do you have a permanent status with the maistraatti? In my experience, you get a temporary henkilötunnus for the period of your trial period in your contract, and after that trial period they change your domicile-status at the Maistraatti into permanent (I had to bring some additional documents for that, but i have noticed that not everyone has to do that).

[sinikettu]

Two girls sharing an appartment is of no interest or concern to Kela.
I know plenty of hetro girls who do just that...
The fact that you are now a student is the only factor that relates to Kela.

The fact that you failed to register at Kela when you were in part time employment is your problem/fault.
That is the point from where to begin your discusion with Kela...take with you proff of employment ..it will help.
Why you left. if you quit or were you laid off?. also relevant.,,length of employment?....

But ...pending a decision..You are now student and will be treated as such.

[fla08]

Despite being a EU citizen, u have to register after 3 month (max. 6 month), than I had the provisorial social security, and than I get the permanent residence permit in June, but as the law at the police has changed in May, they don't specify anymore the reason for coming to Finland, so kela has decided that i come to Finlandfor study reasons...
Concerning being a couple, if you are a hetero couple you are considered as one avopari, it means that I would gt my benefits in the basis of being committed to a finnish citizen. Fr gay couple this right is not recognised unless the reletionship is registered ( marriage). Isn't it discrimination?

[blaugrau]

I think (but am not completely sure) that once you have permanent status in Finland (permanently domiciled) you should be insured regardless of what your current activity is (working or studying), because the Finnish social security system is one based on residence. (I say this because I assume that part of your relationship question was one to do with getting social insurance on grounds of a relationship with a permanent resident in Finland).

You will get the opintotuki only if you have permanent status if Finland, so that might be where the problem actually originated, not so much your grounds of work -- you can come on grounds of work to Finland, but that doesn't mean yet you have permanent status for the authorities. Only once you gained permanent status are you eligible for things like opintotuki and unemployment benefit payed by Kela.

If you don't get the money, and you are not insured -- try to get a part-time job: if your job is at least 18 hours a week, you are insured by Kela. And then try to fit your studies around your work. Once you have permanent status, you can try applying again for the opintotuki.

[sinikettu]

Isn't it discrimination?

What are you bleating about..
Is it your inability to get a Kela card..
Or the fact that you feel that being gay is effecting this (in)ability to get a Kela card.?
If you have only done a few hours part time work in Finland..that is the main reason for not getting a card.

Concentrate on getting your kela card, then you can start looking at what/how much money you shold get.

[blaugrau]

the discrimination of homosexual couples is of course a general problem in many countries in Europe, I think though that Finland has a system of "registration" for homosexual couples, to get at least a degree of equivalence before the law, but I am not sure of that either, maybe someone else knows.

[Tiwaz]

AFAIK there is no concept of common law marriage for gay couples.
If you think for a while you realise why... (hint, I am hetero and I spent great deal of my study time in same apartmen as other male...)

Yes, it would be simply too bothersome to check since you would have majority of same sex "couples" actually living in same apartment for sake of shared expenses instead of love relationship.

So gay would have to register as gay couple. Which would again be pointless. For same amount of trouble you could register "officially" and become a couple (like in marriage).

[blaugrau]

I'm not quite sure I understood your post, Tiwaz, in any case I had thought there is such a concept of "common law marriage" for gay couples, such as the kind of "official registration of gay couples" that exists nowadays in several European countries: like Germany, the Netherlands, the United Kingdom. But good that you correct me in that it doesn't exist in Finland, for some reason I had thought there is such a thing here too.

But -- the issue of gay marriage doesn't really have much to do with the poster's question. I brought it up because I thought it could be one way (out of many) out of the bureaucratic/insurance-related muddle that the poster seems to have got herself in.

[sy]

Despite being a EU citizen, u have to register after 3 month (max. 6 month), than I had the provisorial social security, and than I get the permanent residence permit in June, but as the law at the police has changed in May, they don't specify anymore the reason for coming to Finland, so kela has decided that i come to Finlandfor study reasons...
Concerning being a couple, if you are a hetero couple you are considered as one avopari, it means that I would gt my benefits in the basis of being committed to a finnish citizen. Fr gay couple this right is not recognised unless the reletionship is registered ( marriage). Isn't it discrimination?

I think in your case you are not regarded as residing in Finland "vakinaisesti" (regularly).

I think the law still specifies the reason to come to Finland as an EU citizen. (Check Ulkomaalaislaki Sections 158a and 159a.) In your case, you are probably registered according to Section 158a-1-(2) and Section 159a-1-(3). That is, you should have enough money and sickness insurance, and you won't be a burden to Finnish social security system. You don't have any "permanent residence permit" per se as an EU citizen. You have only registered your residence in Finland. And only after five years of continuous residence in Finland, you'll have the right to permanent residence.

Now, let's go back to the Opintotukilaki. It says:

Ulkomaalaiselle, joka asuu Suomessa vakinaisesti ja jonka
maassa oleskelun peruste on muu kuin opiskelu, voidaan
myöntää opintotukea, jos:
----
2) hän on ulkomaalaislaissa tarkoitettu Euroopan unionin
kansalainen tai tähän rinnastettava taikka hänen perheenjäsenensä,
jonka oleskeluoikeus on ulkomaalaislain
10 luvussa säädetyllä tavalla rekisteröity tai jolle on
myönnetty oleskelukortti; taikka
----

Kela thinks that since before you have had only part-time jobs, and now switched to study, you are not regarded as residing in Finland "vakinaisesti", regardless how your residence has been registered at police.

As regarding to the couple, I think the rule is still that you should have been living together for at least 2 years to be counted as a couple, or got married or registered, regardless to hetero or gay.

[blaugrau]

I agree with sy, only that the definition of "vakinaisesti" on the Kela pages seems a bit outdated -- at least working 2 years continuously is not the condition anymore to be regarded as "permanent" for the opintotuki or other Kela benefits -- I know people who had lived and worked in Finland shorter than that and got the opintotuki. I think what counts is that you have permanent status for the maistraati, and you get that in less than 2 years.

I had to fulfill the trial period of my job (4 months) and after that go back to the Maistraatti, confirm that I'm still holding down the same job, fill in a form (and show them a copy of my translated and apostilled birth certificate, though I understand this wasn't a requirement for everyone in the same situation, so I put that down as a possible case of Turkuness).