International Schools Helsinki, who has kids in ISH, ESH?

Myria · Post by **Myria** » Fri May 20, 2011 5:22 pm

Dear all,

we are moving to Helsinki in late fall this year. Our daughter (7) is bilingual (German and English). She went to pre-K and Kindergarten in the US and is now attending a British International School in Germany. It's her second year in this school, attending class 3.

Is there an overview of the International Schools in Helsinki - sofar I did find the ISH on the Internet and the European Schooling Helsinki.

Are there any parents here in this forum with kids in one of these schools? Please tell me about your experiences!

Thanks for your help!
Myria

**Sponsor:**

Rosamunda · Post by **Rosamunda** » Fri May 20, 2011 5:41 pm

There is also a German/Finnish bilingual school in Helsinki.

My 3 children all spent one year in ISH 2001-2 but then we transferred them into a Finnish school. ISH is so expensive it is not an option for 99,9999% of Finns, it is mostly used by ex-pats on relo contracts and embassy personnel. The turnover in students and staff is quite high (like all international schools). I don't think they teach German there (at least I don't think they did when my kids were there) but French was an option and I guess Russian is on the menu nowadays - not sure. All the students from K2-12 are in the same building which, in my opinion, is not great but the population is so small they don't really have a choice. The facilities in the school are basic but there is a decent library and an IT centre. The sports facilities are limited but it is in the city centre so they use what's available in the city (pools, rinks etc).

As for the "ambiance", it was good when we were - a nice mix of Americans, Finns and other nationalities, there was an active PTA.

It is an IB World School so it is accredited by that organisation and also by ECIS.

ESH is a new school, the fees are lower (subsidised by the Min Edu Finland) so there are probably more Finns there than at ISH (I'm guessing), a lot of the students have parents at ECHA (EU Chemical Agency). I don't have any personal experience of the school.

There are also Finnish state schools and other IB schools (eg Ressu) which teach the Finnish Core Curriculum in English and they are free, including lunch. If you are planning to stay n Finland permanently then I would strongly recommend you choose a FInnish state school.

ajl · Post by **ajl** » Fri May 20, 2011 5:49 pm

Ressu is in Kamppi, very convenient. We have two kids in Ressu and
their classmates are mostly from Helsinki and Espoo.

Ressu's page
http://www.hel.fi/hki/ressuy/en/Etusivu/

Myria · Post by **Myria** » Fri May 20, 2011 6:22 pm

Dear all,

thank you for your quick answers. I am reading and reading - and my head is spinning. So I did read about Komeetta as well and Tähtiniitty. I guess I will have to have a look at all the schools - right? Our daughter is only 7 but already attending 3rd grade - her reading level in English and German is like a 9-year old. She will turn 8 on September 8th - will she have to go back to 1st grade in a regular finnish school?

The company my husband works for will take care of any school fees - so ISH would not be a question of tution fees - I am more interested in the best possible education. We will stay in Helsinki at least for 5 years - may be longer.

A German/Finish school is not an option for us - it's more important that she keeps her English.

Thanks and please post more!!!
Myria

onkko · Post by **onkko** » Fri May 20, 2011 7:41 pm

Myria wrote: We will stay in Helsinki at least for 5 years - may be longer.

A German/Finish school is not an option for us - it's more important that she keeps her English.

5 years or longer... i think you should drop english down in your important list and add finnish in top of it. Penelope and other parents whom childrens are looking for further education can probably tell more why.
I dont think keeping english is big problem since we dont dub like germans do

Rosamunda · Post by **Rosamunda** » Fri May 20, 2011 8:37 pm

If you are staying a minimum of 5 years then I would definitely opt for a Finnish school. It is extremely UNLIKELY that your daughter will learn any Finnish if she is at ISH. Probably the same at ESH, I don't know for sure.

The PISA tests (which ranked Finland #1 in the world) were taken in Finnish state schools. In these schools the teachers all have Masters degrees in either Primary Years education or their subject area. I think it is the quality of the teaching staff which contributes to Finland's success.

If your daughter is a confident student with no learning difficulties then she could probably cope with starting off from scratch in a new language (and she is at the perfect age to do that since Finnish kids start school at 7yrs). There are immigrant integration programmes available in Espoo (I think Tähtiniitty has one) and also in Helsinki. This means you get intensive Finnish language tuition in a small group and then the child gradually switches into regular classroom lessons. You can keep up her English at home through reading and games.

Komeetta has an English-only stream (this is where my boys went to school) but I was really disappointed with the Finnish foreign language teaching. It was really hopeless, no structure, no materials, no programme, no personalised learning plans, no feedback, no homework. The whole thing lacked focus and commitment and my 3 children have suffered considerably as a result of that. If I could start all over again, I would put them into a Finnish school. At the time (2002) Tähtiniitty wouldn't take children without any Finnish into their bilingual stream (neither would the Lycée Franco-Finlandais, or The English School!) but I believe that has changed.

I like the IB schools , the programmes and the methods. But the big problem in Finland is the bottleneck after middle school. There are so few places in IB high schools that entry onto the IB diploma programme has become highly competitive. Most of the children on PYP and MYP don't stand a chance of getting into an IB high school. That might all sounds light years away, but you really have to think about long term objectives (we didn't and regret it enormously). Komeetta is a great place for Finnish kids who have fluent Finnish and want to become actively bilingual. But it doesn't work for native English speakers who want to achieve fluency in Finnish.

Not speaking Finnish is a serious handicap when choosing secondary school options. The best secondary schools (especially the schools that specialise in music, sport, art, science, maths etc) require fluent Finnish.

Myria · Post by **Myria** » Sat May 21, 2011 12:29 am

Dear all,

oh , thank you so much for your opinion. This means a lot to us.

Because everybody told us Finnish is very very difficult to learn, we did think of ISH first and ESH second and never considered a regular finnish school. Yes we did hear about Pisa and we do know about the bad reputation German schools have.This is why our daughter is in a British school in Germany right now and not in a regular German school. And because we did relocate quite a lot in the past couple of years, and we knew that Germany is not our final destination, - it was important she will keep her English.

My husband had a lot of job offers from all over the world - in Helsinki he found the most wonderful and best team ever - he just LOVES his team and the Fin-spirit! For him - this is it! So after two years of commuting, we decided to relocate to Helsinki. WOW: what a challange. ...

On the other hand we are spoiled, because our daughter went to a wonderful Montessori school in the US - and we are sooooo disappointed with the British school she is in at present. We miss the enthusiasm and "spark" the Montessori school had. This was so special. Our daughter did kind of flourish and developed so many positive skills - it was overwhelming. The Montessori School in the US did magic on her.

We are really looking for a school with enthusiasm and the special "spark". With teachers who love to teach and care deeply for the children they take care of.

How about adults? Some of my husbands' colleagues live in Finland over 18 years and are not able to speak fluent Finnish - did they not try hard enough - or is it really that difficult and hard to learn?

If there is more personal or general information out there in the forum - please tell me!

Myria

onkko · Post by **onkko** » Sat May 21, 2011 1:07 am

Myria wrote: Because everybody told us Finnish is very very difficult to learn, we did think of ISH first and ESH second and never considered a regular finnish school....

How about adults? Some of my husbands' colleagues live in Finland over 18 years and are not able to speak fluent Finnish - did they not try hard enough - or is it really that difficult and hard to learn?

Difficulty is totally perspective, to your doughter it isnt hard since she isnt hardwired to anything yet. She is still "blank book".
To adults with non finno-ugrian background it is of course hard like learning japanese or english is to me or other finns.

Your husbands' colleagues are arrogant assholes who wont even care to be part of this society and thats why they arent looked as one, deserve be one or deserve be anything else that usable foreigner.

Jukka Aho · Post by **Jukka Aho** » Sat May 21, 2011 1:27 am

Myria wrote:our daughter went to a wonderful Montessori school in the US - and we are sooooo disappointed with the British school she is in at present. We miss the enthusiasm and "spark" the Montessori school had. This was so special. Our daughter did kind of flourish and developed so many positive skills - it was overwhelming. The Montessori School in the US did magic on her.

We are really looking for a school with enthusiasm and the special "spark". With teachers who love to teach and care deeply for the children they take care of.

I have absolutely no experience on the Montessori methodology whatsoever but there’s a Montessori association in Finland and some kindergartens and schools using the Montessori educational approach. You can find a list of the schools here. See also the contact details page for the association if you’d like to drop them a note.

Myria wrote:How about adults? Some of my husbands' colleagues live in Finland over 18 years and are not able to speak fluent Finnish - did they not try hard enough - or is it really that difficult and hard to learn?

The Kielikoulu forum has lots of information for people who are studying / learning / teaching themselves Finnish as a second language. If you’d like to ask people about their experiences and opinions just post a question there or browse the old threads. (The subject has come up several times over the years... but ultimately, it’s a different experience for every learner.)

Rosamunda · Post by **Rosamunda** » Sun May 22, 2011 11:07 pm

There is a Steiner school in Olari (not too far from Komeetta School), the language of instruction is Finnish.
http://www.espoonsteinerkoulu.fi/
(Weird font on the webpage, suggests a Russian connection ??? but there isn't as far as I know!!!)
I have heard good reports about the school. It is in a brand new building next to Olari lukio (one of the best high schools in the region). You could add it to your list of schools to visit... I think the best idea is to visit them all and ask lots of questions. We were in Budapest and were unable to visit all the schools but there were definitely a couple that we scratched off our list just on the basis of some exceptionally unhelpful telephone conversations.

Jukka Aho · Post by **Jukka Aho** » Mon May 23, 2011 12:55 am

penelope wrote:http://www.espoonsteinerkoulu.fi/
(Weird font on the webpage, suggests a Russian connection ??? but there isn't as far as I know!!!)

Maybe that font does look a bit like the typefaces used in some Soviet propaganda posters, but I can’t see it deliberately mimicking that style – or the Cyrillic alphabet, for that matter. There are other Latin fonts which are trying to recreate that Soviet-era aesthetic, though.

Cyrillic text often gives me visually the same impact as a wall of text written in Latin lettering using small-caps style...

Rosamunda · Post by **Rosamunda** » Mon May 23, 2011 11:22 am

I know plenty of foreigners here but I don't think I know any who have come here as adults and achieved fluency. At best, and given plenty of time, it is possible to achieve an adequate level of comprehension and some productive skills. But fluency? Extremely unlikely (and probably not necessary unless you have ambitions to become a translator).

Living in the Helsinki region it is extremely easy to get by without speaking fluent Finnish and it won't stop you meeting people and making friends. It will prevent you from going to the theatre (and doing other cultural stuff) but the libraries are full of English language books and there are occasionally plays in English eg by the FinnBrit Players and the University's Thespians Anonymous and touring performances.

I use English all day in my job so my spoken Finnish is really awful and my listening skills are not great either (been here ten years). But I can read OK and understand basic conversations at home (husband vs the kids). I can follow what's happening in the news: Helsingin Sanomat, the internet etc. When I have some free time I'll take some more courses, and eventually sit the language exam for citizenship. But I will never achieve fluency.

Upphew · Post by **Upphew** » Mon May 23, 2011 11:44 am

Myria wrote:How about adults? Some of my husbands' colleagues live in Finland over 18 years and are not able to speak fluent Finnish - did they not try hard enough - or is it really that difficult and hard to learn?

As other have noted, it isn't hard per se (every Finn has learned it, even children, how hard it can be!?!), but unless you are willing to put some resources and effort to it, you won't learn it. Thus if you are time constrained and don't have sincere motivation to learn...

Myria wrote:If there is more personal or general information out there in the forum - please tell me!

Here is a lot of personal and general information. Ask or try the search function located at upper right corner.

Myria · Post by **Myria** » Mon May 23, 2011 12:57 pm

Dear all,

thank you so much for your support! I will definitely visit several finnish schools to get an impression. I am really curious about the Steiner school.

If there is more information out there - for example about schools in Espoo, please let me know. Especially about integrating foreign kids into the system and how long it took your kids to become fluent.

And thanks for the links - I will have to spend some time to read - and I will !! - there is so much useful knowledge out there, once you know where to look - so please do not hesitate to send me more.

Take care
Myria

Upphew · Post by **Upphew** » Mon May 23, 2011 1:13 pm

Myria wrote:I am really curious about the Steiner school.

Wikipedia might be a good starter: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waldorf_education

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