Suspected Marriage of Convenience with a twist

raso · Post by **raso** » Wed Oct 29, 2014 8:19 pm

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AldenG · Post by **AldenG** » Wed Oct 29, 2014 10:49 pm

Is paternity genetically proven or merely assumed?

Is he recorded in the registry as the father?

raso · Post by **raso** » Wed Oct 29, 2014 11:37 pm

AldenG wrote:Is paternity genetically proven or merely assumed?

Is he recorded in the registry as the father?

Yes he is recorded as a father in the registry. Oh and I forgot to mention that they are both non-EU residents.

raso · Post by **raso** » Wed Oct 29, 2014 11:52 pm

tummansininen wrote:Is the baby a Finnish citizen? No point cancelling the other parent's RP if they'll just get another one to stay with the baby.

No the baby is not a finnish citizen. I think i need to clarify a little more here. They have the baby after they registered as married couple. But they have never lived together as a couple.
If the officials at migri believe that the marriage was not a real one, does the presence of the baby prevent them from deporting the parents( and the baby too)?

Pursuivant · Post by **Pursuivant** » Thu Oct 30, 2014 12:13 am

AldenG wrote:Is paternity genetically proven or merely assumed?
Is he recorded in the registry as the father?

The husband of the mother is always the father. It requires a lot of court litigation and dna testing to prove otherwise, and its very rare to get it changed.

AldenG · Post by **AldenG** » Thu Oct 30, 2014 12:19 am

Pursuivant wrote:
AldenG wrote:Is paternity genetically proven or merely assumed?
Is he recorded in the registry as the father?
The husband of the mother is always the father. It requires a lot of court litigation and dna testing to prove otherwise, and its very rare to get it changed.

What if the baby came before the marriage?

Pursuivant · Post by **Pursuivant** » Thu Oct 30, 2014 12:55 am

Well then it can be holy spirit

raso · Post by **raso** » Thu Oct 30, 2014 1:42 am

@ tummansininen,

You have a good point there. I know people in a similar situation. I think the police is sniffing around them asking questions and stuff, these two fellas are worried like hell.

rinso · Post by **rinso** » Thu Oct 30, 2014 7:41 am

there is a compelling evidence to prove the marriage was in fact a sham marriage
the two never lived together
they are both non-EU residents.
the baby is not a finnish citizen.

Based on these statements I think their RP can indeed be revoked unless they can show a very good reason why they did not lived together (i.e. jobs far apart).

Better problems to solve if you ask me.

Common sense versus bureaucracy.

Rip · Post by **Rip** » Thu Oct 30, 2014 9:37 am

Pursuivant wrote: The husband of the mother is always the father. It requires a lot of court litigation and dna testing to prove otherwise, and its very rare to get it changed.

Not rare, but impossible for an outsider to do. Nobody outside the family has a legal standing to challenge the legal fatherhood of the husband. That would include the Kenyan guy having a striking resemblance to the baby boy of the blue-eyed blond married couple living next door, or any official.

Having said that, if there is no social family relationship between the father from the one hand and the mother and child from the other, then presumably the residence permit(s) that based no family relationship could be revoked. There are court cases when being a (uncontested genetic) father has not been a sufficient grounds for a RP if one has not shown any interest to the child for an extended period of time.

Pursuivant · Post by **Pursuivant** » Thu Oct 30, 2014 11:30 am

Yes, Mr Cuckold the husband can raise a case if the baby peculiarily resembles Mr Crane the postman, but Mr Crane can't. Even after Mr&Mrs cuckold divorce and she becomes Mrs Crane it'd be very hard.

Nimi · Post by **Nimi** » Thu Oct 30, 2014 12:49 pm

raso wrote:Hello everyone,

I have a rather unusual question to ask. Will the immigration office act upon a marriage of convenience that has allegedly happened three years ago? And, (here is where it gets weird), what if the two have a baby together and the police finds out that the two never lived together and there is a compelling evidence to prove the marriage was in fact a sham marriage? will their residence permit be in jeopardy?

What do you mean by a sham marriage and having a child together? People can have a child without living together or married it is common. The wife did not know when she was fixing his bladder in her valve , uptil when she stomach the baby for 9 months before poohing it out?
This is now becoming annoying when 2 adults cannot solve their differences and wanting to cause a life time stigma for a poor growing child. It hurts to grow up as a child not being sure of your paternity or somehow being rejected by one parent.

it is soooo bad do not travel that path with the child, I am a living proof even when I got rejected as an adult the wound is or cannot be healed!

AldenG · Post by **AldenG** » Thu Oct 30, 2014 6:21 pm

I guess I've been a wee bit confused about the anatomical details of all that...

chriscross · Post by **chriscross** » Sat Nov 01, 2014 9:30 am

Nimi wrote:
raso wrote:Hello everyone,

I have a rather unusual question to ask. Will the immigration office act upon a marriage of convenience that has allegedly happened three years ago? And, (here is where it gets weird), what if the two have a baby together and the police finds out that the two never lived together and there is a compelling evidence to prove the marriage was in fact a sham marriage? will their residence permit be in jeopardy?
What do you mean by a sham marriage and having a child together? People can have a child without living together or married it is common. The wife did not know when she was fixing his bladder in her valve , uptil when she stomach the baby for 9 months before poohing it out?
This is now becoming annoying when 2 adults cannot solve their differences and wanting to cause a life time stigma for a poor growing child. It hurts to grow up as a child not being sure of your paternity or somehow being rejected by one parent.

it is soooo bad do not travel that path with the child, I am a living proof even when I got rejected as an adult the wound is or cannot be healed!

that brightened my morning up hahaha

007 · Post by **007** » Sat Nov 01, 2014 4:20 pm

raso wrote:
tummansininen wrote:Is the baby a Finnish citizen? No point cancelling the other parent's RP if they'll just get another one to stay with the baby.
No the baby is not a finnish citizen. I think i need to clarify a little more here. They have the baby after they registered as married couple. But they have never lived together as a couple.
If the officials at migri believe that the marriage was not a real one, does the presence of the baby prevent them from deporting the parents( and the baby too)?

What's the legal ground for them to be in Finland? It's confusing because if she is a legal resident of Finland and through her, he has gotten the residence permit, then in case of a sham marriage, it's him that gets the boots... don't see whole family having to exit Finland!?

Once I saw a document on Tv where a couple, an African father and a Finnish mother of a Finnish child, was fighting at court to bring African father back to Finland, who was deported from Finland because he was illegally in Finland before they had a child, and the child was seen as an anchor to have him stay in Finland. So... chances of getting permit revoked are there.

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